My Condolences to San Francisco

My condolences to San Francisco who yesterday passed a firearms ban, similar to the illegal one that DC passed a while back. Jason over in San Francisco has some thoughts that apply as much to us here as it does there:

So I hope you recover from your bout of insanity and I hope you don’t get shot in your home by an armed assailant. Seriously, that would suck. What would be worse though is while sitting in your living room, your neighbor is being robbed and they’re forced to defend themself with the 12 gauge shotgun they had to buy instead of a handgun and the spray from the buckshot that misses the burglar goes through the wall and hits you in the face. That would suck a lot too I believe.

17 Comments so far

  1. Concerned parent (unregistered) on November 9th, 2005 @ 11:52 pm

    Yeah! More importantly though, how is my son supposed to shoot himself in the face after finding my handgun and playing with it now that I’m not allowed to have one!


  2. Tom Bridge (unregistered) on November 10th, 2005 @ 7:45 am

    What kind of parent are you that just leaves guns out for your child to play with? BAD MOMMY!

    This is why locked drawers, trigger locks and unloading your weapons are all part of Firearm Ownership 101.


  3. Martin (unregistered) on November 10th, 2005 @ 10:08 am

    Wait…how is the District’s gun ban “illegal”? It was passed by the City Council, and no court has yet to overturn it. What part of it is illegal?


  4. Tom Bridge (unregistered) on November 10th, 2005 @ 10:17 am

    Given that the Constitution provides an amendment that reserves citizens the right to bear arms, I’d say that’s pretty clear that this ban is against the spirit, if not the precise letter, of the wishes of the founders.


  5. Martin (unregistered) on November 10th, 2005 @ 10:56 am

    The Constitution also provides that Congress shall pass no laws respecting the freedom of speech, though the Supreme Court has accepted that some restrictions are permissible.

    Can’t the same be said for the Second Amendment?

    And remember, the D.C. gun ban only applies to handguns. D.C. residents can still own and store rifles and shotguns, which, in the event of a robbery, are WAY scarier.


  6. Tom Bridge (unregistered) on November 10th, 2005 @ 11:28 am

    But, as Jason said, pellets travel well through drywall, and spray indiscriminantly. Pistols are far more easily controlled and aimed. Of course, that requires training and practice, which are recommended for gun owners anyhow.

    And though restrictions on speech are approved, why are restrictions on handguns required? Making guns illegal won’t make them disappear, which is why the murder rate went up after the law was enacted.


  7. Concerned parent (unregistered) on November 10th, 2005 @ 5:35 pm

    How am I supposed to defend myself against a theif if I locked my gun in a drawer? I’m dead before I can get to it.


  8. wayan (unregistered) on November 10th, 2005 @ 6:25 pm

    Oh is this such an easy one…

    Illegal Gun Ban Right, and the NRA would sit back and let an illegal gun ban stand when they’re fighting so many legal bans. Like speach, guns carry responsiblities with usage – we can’t yell “fire” in a movie theatre and we can’t wear sidearms, or well not in civilized states anyway.

    Foiling Crimes w/ a Gun Please, I dare you, find me a stastical analysis that shows have a gun in a house somehow reduces the incidence of robbery or home invasion by a greater margin than the increase in accidental shootings or, more importantly, premeditated or heat of the moment passion killings that result from a gun in the house.

    Shotgun vs Handgun How many stray bullet stories do we hear where little girls die sitting inside their house? I’d much rather be downrange of a pellet, which would stop somewhere in the wall or at bone, than a bullet, which might be one incased in steel and can penetrate an entire house, or hollow point which would take out a whole skull, or just plain old lead like the one that killed Chelsea Cromartie.

    The Logic Test Last but not least, how many times have you awoke with a robber in your house Tom? Or even in your neighbour’s house? Or felt so threatened in suburbia that you felt the need to be armed? And if you were, would you really pull out your Colt 45 and dare him to make your day?


  9. Don (unregistered) on November 10th, 2005 @ 6:34 pm

    I pull out my colt 45 all the time, but I try to remember to spill a little for my lost homies. It never fails to make my day, though.


  10. Tom Bridge (unregistered) on November 10th, 2005 @ 8:55 pm

    If you’re dead before you can get to a nearby weapon, a lot of good your gun ban did, didn’t it, Concerned Parent? Because that means your assailant was also armed.


  11. Tom Bridge (unregistered) on November 10th, 2005 @ 9:16 pm

    And no one is saying that you should be able to get a gun at a convenience store, Wayan. Rights DO come with responsibilities, like being responsible for education about your weapon, proper storage of same, proper treatment of same.

    This also isn’t about being a cowboy or Dirty Harry, it’s about being allowed to exercise your rights. After Katrina, you can’t tell me you wouldn’t want to own a gun in case of that kind of disaster. After Katrina, you can’t tell me that we can depend on the Police to save our bacon.


  12. UnusualCandor (unregistered) on November 10th, 2005 @ 10:26 pm

    Wayan, here is a response to your comments.

    1. The NRA has been fighting to have Congress to repeal the illegal DC gun ban. There has been a movement in Congress to overturn the ban. Unfortunately, the squishes on Capitol Hill decided to take that provision out of the DC appropriation just this week. I would say Virginia is a civilized state and they allow open, visible carrying of a handgun.

    2. Go here to see a fact sheet that shows that gun ownership has gone up, the number of states that have right to carry laws has gone up, gun control laws have been eliminated, and HOLY SHIT!!, crime has gone down. And before you say the stats are biased, look at the footnotes. They are from ATF and DOJ stats.

    3. Without being graphic, I would hope that someone using hollow point round as opposed to a sold lead round. Solid lead rounds go further and go through more things. Hollow point rounds are designed to stop when they hit something. That is part of the reason they cause as much damage as they do when they hit flesh.

    4. I have lived in suburbia my entire life. First in the burbs of St. Louis, and now in NOVA. I don’t feel unsafe out here. But every area has crime and I want to be able to defend myself. If you want to depend on the police, great. But don’t take away my right and my choice to defend my person and my property. I hope that I never have to point a firearm at another person, but if I need to do so to protect myself, my future family, or my property, I will.

    Firearms are not something to be scared of. In the hands of someone who knows what they are doing, they are incredibly safe.

    My father taught me how to shoot a .22 when I was 8 or 9. He also taught me how to properly handle a weapon and to not touch them without him being around (now that I am 27, he lets me do my thing). I was then also taught how to shoot when I was in Cub Scouts and Boy Scouts. Firearms do not scare me. Criminals having them and lawful citizens not having them scare me. I have had a pump shotgun pulled on me. And I can tell you there is nothing scarier than hearing that ever familiar sound of a shell being chambered.


  13. unconcerned parent (unregistered) on November 11th, 2005 @ 8:29 am

    just because laws are broken they shouldnt be made? so i guess homocide should be taken off the crime list…


  14. Tom Bridge (unregistered) on November 11th, 2005 @ 8:40 am

    Bad laws shouldn’t made at all, parent. This is a bad law, it doesn’t protect anyone.


  15. wayan (unregistered) on November 11th, 2005 @ 9:07 am

    True, crime stats have dropped, but show me how they directly correlate with gun ownership. Violent crime is usually very closely correlated with 18-24 men, substance abuse, and unemployment, not legal gun ownership.

    And gun ownership wouldn’t make me feel safer, and I know how to use ’em. A marksman in my youth, I can still calibrate for wind and distance with a .223, but am very happy to live in a city where guns are restricted.

    Because its not that I fear guns, I fear the mix of explosive anger + alcohol + easy access to guns. That’s the combo that lets lead fly. And unless you can prove that you’ve never lost your temper and/or did something stupid when drunk, I say guns, especially handguns, should not be in people’s nightstands or houses.

    Now homes with kids, that’s a tragedy waiting to happen. Unless again, you can prove that your child would never be able to access that gun w/o your presence. Before you answer that, think back to your childhood & what you got into, then let my 5 year old cousin wander in your place for an hour.

    But we digress. The original post here talked about an illegal gun ban in DC. And the simple answer to that is – it’s not illegal. We, the DC electorate, through our elected representatives, enjoy our gun free DC through a open, democratic governmental process.

    Oh yeah, Tom & UC, you don’t even live here, so it’s not of your control (thankfully!) either. Just be sure to check your bandolier and six shooters at the Potomac.


  16. UnusualCandor (unregistered) on November 11th, 2005 @ 12:36 pm

    Wayan, you are unfortunately correct that the DC gun ban is not “illegal.” That is because the Supreme Court has not made the 2nd ammendment an individual right like the 1st, 5th, etc. Maybe a new SCOTUS will change that. The DC gun ban certainly goes against the spirit of the 2nd Ammendment. “A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.”

    Now as far as your whatif about children, give me a break. The cases where children are injured or killed by a gun because of poor care by the parents or another adult who is caring for them, those people should go to prison for a long, long time.

    unless your 5 year old cousin can break through a steel cabinet, I can guaran-damn-tee I could have never gotten into my father’s guns and no child could get near a handgun or any other firearm I may own. That is because even if I use the thing for home protection, it will get locked away whenever anyone is in my home visiting. And yes, I would do that every time. These are principles of responsible gun ownership.

    The vast majority of gun owners are responsible individuals who are mindful of what firearms are capable of in the hands of people who shouldn’t have them. But we cannot continue to make laws that infringe on the rights of a large majority because of a realtively small number of people. This may sound cold and heartless, but this is the real world. Bad things happen.

    Finally go look here: http://www.disastercenter.com/crime/dccrime.htm The DC Gun Ban was put into place in 1976. That ban has done nothing to reduce violent crime in the District. All it has done is keep law abiding citizens from possibly protecting themselves. Now if you will excuse me, I must go renew my NRA membership.


  17. wayan (unregistered) on November 11th, 2005 @ 1:00 pm

    Your link to crime stats prove my earlier point; crime is a function more of youth + drugs (alcohol & drugs) – gainful employment opportunities. It has nothing to do with gun ownership as crime rates in DC have yo-yoed since 1976 (currently down from the early 90’s highs) and we still do not have sidearms on 16th Street.

    We do have a Constitution that I believe intended for us to have a well regulated militia – the original Minutemen for example. This to me today is the National Guard.

    If we have to take it to the people, and I understand the argument for it, then regulated ownership by well trained & responsible gun owners.

    I’m thinking something akin to a safety driving course + drivers license + regular inspection/registration to make sure folks act like you say you do – with respect for the power of firearms.



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